thaFormula.com - What is the difference between EL-P releasing an album in 2002 on Def Jux as opposed to releasing an album now in 2007?

El-P - Not much difference man. I still put my heart into the shit. I still put my all into it so I always approach the records that way. The only thing that's changed is the world around me you know and the stories that I have to tell change 'cause you know its 5 years difference you know? You know how much can happen in a mans life in that much time and not just my life but in all of our lives? I just think that there are stories that are worth telling, but you know I always approach records the same way. I just look at it like its something that I have to do and its something that I love. I just leave it up to the listeners to decide what the difference is.

thaFormula.com - As you look at the major labels and as we hear about the industry pretty much imploding on itself right now, what goes through your head?

El-P - What goes through my head? Joy. Fuck it, let it all implode, let it all evaporate in itself because at the end of the day the one thing that people will love and will always love is good music. I think the industry is suffering to a degree because it hasn't created a culture of art. It's created a culture of money. But money changes and money moves around so you know I just stick to trying to make records and try to deal with people who are making records that are real artistic statements to them and that they are passionate about. I don't worry about what's happening in the industry because I think a good record is a good record and its something that people will always love and respect. The rest of this shit we will just figure out as we go along.

thaFormula.com - Is this something that maybe your predicted yourself would happen a long time ago?

El-P - Nah man, its just impossible to forecast everything but you know the one thing that I always believed in was that peoples true voices are more powerful then anyone's construct or pop construct or idea of commercial music. Not that commercial music sucks, but like music just strictly created for mass consumption alone doesn't really make for anything. If it's about money then yeah of course it's easy to predict because the only reason why anyone ever got behind Hip-Hop music is because it started making money. But the rest of the time it was an outlaw subculture of music that no one even respected. To me it hasn't changed as I never chased the golden carrot. What I do and the way that I look at it never changes. People keep wanting to talk about Hip-Hop is dead and shit, well not to me because I never fucking sold my soul. I never played that game. I've always been in love with this shit.

thaFormula.com - Do you think that as the sales tumble, we will eventually reach the point where we will all be on a level playing field as far as mainstream artists and so called underground artists recording together more often?

El-P - I think that musicians are musician's period and the things that are created around them are a little bit weird but musicians love music. It's like the differences in genres and the differences in the industry are created but the business around it and the way the people react to it are different. I just think the people who are serious about what they are doing and love what they are doing and are doing it for the right reasons will find a way to stick around with it because its bigger then business right? Even if I couldn't sell a record, I would still make records.

thaFormula.com - Its like the picture you took with Puff recently and the whole Myspace thing that went down. Let's say you did work with Puff, do you think it will ever get to the point where you could work with Puff and it wouldn't matter?

El-P - Well it depends on who it matters to. I mean like I could do that shit right now and it wouldn't matter to me if I felt it. It's really about people's perceptions and the way they see these things. I think that one of the reasons why Hip-Hop music culture has seemed to implode on itself is because everybody has gotten really caught up in self-definition. We have had a couple of decades now to think about what we are doing here. Some of the negative effects of it are that people have created in their minds and publicly you know lines in the sand. Like "alright this is this type of music, that is that type of music." When I was growing up, it was Hip-Hop and when I was growing up it was like "alright, either I listen to rock music or I listen to hip hop." Now I'm not saying that that attitude was the right one either, but it was a lot more expansive than the one now. Now it's like "alright I listen to rap music, but this is the type of rap music I listen to." For me it was like you had De La Soul and NWA playing on the same radio station when I was growing up. I don't really give a fuck though, I don't care. I don't pay attention to it so you know what, fuck all of it to me. No one can really tell anyone who is just doing their thing, shit. It's not just Hip-Hop though, it's the entire music industry that's on the decline and the reason why in my opinion is because these are hard times, these are strange times, these are times of war, these are times of treachery and danger and frankly music is kind of a frivolous joy. Music is not the most important thing right now especially because no one is really saying shit. Why would people keep handing over their hard earned cash? Their cash that is being stretched further and further 'cause the economy is going further and further down the shitter. How can I ask someone to hand over their dough to me when I'm not even putting my heart into my records, I'm not even saying anything? I'm not even aware enough as an artist to even put myself into a record. I'm making records dependent on someone else. Muthafuckas see through that shit eventually.

thaFormula.com - Now your album leaked out early and has gotten praised by a lot of people. I know you appreciate that but at the same time how does it feel knowing that it's not even out yet and they are praising your album they downloaded?

El-P - At this point in our culture it's a normal thing for a record to leak like that. If you can name the record that's been released in the last 5 years that hasn't been online first, I will send you 100 dollars. It's a game that we are playing with each other man between the consumer and the provider of the music. It's a cat and mouse game. It's like I know my shit is gonna get leaked so let me make it a little bit harder. So it's just a game man. I know the deal and I'm not afraid of the whole thing. If you make a good record then people will support you, I believe that so I'm not worried about it, I'm not worried about people not supporting me. Fans know for better or for worse and are used to getting the record ahead of time and being able to check out the product. To me its like "yeah no doubt if I wanna buy a car I'm gonna test drive that bitch." People are tired of buying a car cause the shit looks shiny and then looking under the hood when they get home and realizing that its like a motorcycle engine. I understand the idea, so the only thing that you can do to combat that whole shit is make a great record that people are gonna wanna own. Make a great package, put together a great artistic package. Make something that people are gonna wanna support. Be the type of artist that people are gonna feel not great about not supporting. It's a give and take man. Of course I want people to support me and it's something that we ask of our fans, like "yo if you like this shit then support us because we cant make these records without you supporting us," period. If its something that's important to you, then back it up. At the same time the industry is kind of fucked up because we are asking kids to pay more for records then we ever have been and they can get it for free. It's hard man. If it were up to me, I would be selling my records 10 dollars flat, but retail doesn't wanna do that. It's like they are to used to the old fucking way, so you have all this whole structure of people that are just like entrenched in the old school way of selling shit but the world has changed around them completely and the kids have changed around them, so its difficult. So the only thing I can do is make the best possible album in the hope that you don't wanna hear some dudes voice on the shit saying "this is a promo."

thaFormula.com - Well it seems to have gotten a good reaction from people so far?

El-P - It has, that's the other thing it has and that's all good. It's like, well it could be worse. The thing is you gotta make records where you're not tricking everyone. At this point since the records are gonna be available online, people are gonna know if the shit sucks or not ahead of time. It's like maybe it another motivating factor for people to just kind of get their game tight and then just make the right record because if you know that its being judged by kids ahead of time then you better make that shit dope.

thaFormula.com - Are you surprised that the whole Rawkus thing got as far as it got off of what you said?

El-P - Where did it get to? I wrote a Myspace blog and they did a full court media press.

thaFormula.com - Yeah, we got a press release on it and I was tripping out like "wow this thing has spread pretty far."

El-P - Yeah, you know whatever man. I don't give a fuck what anyone thinks. My history is my history and really reality wise, it's between them and me. They just pissed me off. I just don't like when muthafuckas poke me in the ribs. Don't fuck with a man who feels he has got legitimate issues and don't fuck with me 'cause I'm the dude that can actually express them correctly and that's all it is man. Those dudes, they operate differently then I operate and they always have and they always will and I don't give a fuck. It's more beneficial to them to make a big deal out of this shit, then it is to me. 'cause to me, I'm chillin'. I got a good thing going here. They are just trying to do what they do. I don't even care man, no beef. I said what I had to say on a Myspace blog and they did a full on media press blitz. To me it's almost like they are just using it as an opportunity and it doesn't matter to me. I got no malice towards anyone, I got personal history with cats, I'm not just ranting for no reason. There are reasons why I am not that pleased with them in general. I have kept my mouth shut for a long time. I say it just like don't poke the cobra. Don't fucking poke a stick at the cobra in a cage. You know don't point your finger at the muthafucker and poke it because it might bite you. The only thing I'm surprised at is how many people paid attention to that little fucking blog that I wrote and I'm surprised at Rawkus' reaction that they took it so seriously that they actually went out of their way to hire a publicity agent. To me its like fuck all that shit. I don't want anyone knowing about that and I don't even care. I don't care about the players involved, I don't care about the results, I don't need the publicity, I don't want it. I'm not sorry and I've never fucking apologized for speaking my mind and if anyone else wants to fuck with me and I got some legitimate issues with them, Ill speak on them too. But I'm not some dude running around trying to cause beef or anything like that. As far as I'm concerned, everyone can just do their thing. Just leave my fucking name out of it. So that whole thing to me is silly to me. It's ridiculous and I think the fans can read between the lines.

thaFormula.com - It's just crazy how I even heard someone who is in a group signed to Rawkus talking like they were mad about it...

El-P - People should do their research. I'm not shitting on anybody except for the people that shit on me and I got legitimate history way beyond anyone signing a contract now with those dudes. I'm not going out on a media blitz and I don't even wanna talk about it.

thaFormula.com - I mean I remember Shabaam talking about Rawkus and certain things in an interview we did a while back so I know you weren't the only one...

El-P - And guess what, 2 days before I wrote that shit I saw Shabaam for the first time in five years 'cause he had just gotten home from prison and that was my man for a long time and he was supposed to be putting records out and uh you know whatever man. There is a history there, I hope the best for everybody involved, I really want success for everybody and that's all cool. I spoke my piece and it has nothing to do with anyone else except me and those dudes and I'm just gonna leave it there.

thaFormula.com - So what made you decide that 2007 was the time for you to put out a new album and what were you trying to do on this album Hip-Hop wise that you maybe hadn't done before or hadn't been done before?

El-P - It was my time because I had been waiting patiently in the weeds waiting for my moment. I put records out when I feel I have something to say and when I'm done with saying it. I take my time on my records and every record that I do I look at it as the last record I'll ever make so I take the shit seriously. I had some shit that I wanted to say. My life, my role and my career has gotten a lot bigger then just myself as an artist, but at the same time that is really the truest form of who I am. So when I put these records out I want them to really mean something and I wanna take my time with them. I don't know if there was anything specific I was trying to do except maybe the eloquent translation of what its like to be a confused and regular muthafucka in strange times and I felt like I could maybe take a snapshot of the city and of my life and my perspective that I don't really feel like to many people were reppin'. I feel like there is so much to say and there is so much going on it should just be the ripest environment for creativity right now.

thaFormula.com - It just seems like everyone is so confused on which direction to go?

El-P - No one is just running with their heart. Everybody is just running around trying to clamor for biting and vying for personalities. There is like 3 personalities out there and everybody is competing for it. You got the drug dealer personality, you got the playboy personality and you got the master of the universe personality. I'm none of those. I'm just a kid who is trying to get through the muck and mire of just a weird ass life where everything around me is falling apart and yet I still wanna live and I still have hope and I wanted to make that record. I felt like being that voice was worthy of sitting down and making another record.

thaFormula.com - One thing that is for sure is that these times now are some of the weirdest times I have ever seen?

El-P - Yeah. These are our generation's landmark time's man. So where are those records? Where are those records that are gonna reflect that in ten years? Are you gonna be able to look back on this period of time and see the art that reflected the time? 'Cause right now I can't really point at any rap records right now apart from I don't know, here and there that really are like the soundtrack to the way I see shit right now. Most people don't have the time to sit around and ponder life. They have to go out and fucking work a 9 to 5. If we are gonna be these dudes who are lucky enough to be allowed to live this life by the very kind public who are gonna be like "yeah you know what, how about this, you just chill and be creative and we will give you a little bit of money and you could live your life that way" and who am I to waste everybody's time with some sort of bullshit that doesn't mean anything? You know my job in life is to literally lay it all on the line every time I do a song.

thaFormula.com - When the smoke clears from everything collapsing, what do you see happening?

El-P - I see the same thing every time everything collapses. That muthafuckas drag themselves out of the mud and they live on and none of it matters, it's all repetitive. All we have is the way that we carry ourselves, our honor, our words and the way that we care and the way that we live. That's my only reaction. I don't have any other reaction to everything that's going on except that I better live these times and mean it. I don't have any time to waste about being confused about who I am. I don't have any time to waste lying to anyone or bullshiting myself. I just think these are the times where everyone has to really just fucking face themselves and be who it is that they are supposed to be. Be who it is that your destiny says your gonna be. Don't be that dude in ten years, don't imagine that your gonna be some great person 'cause chances are its not gonna happen.

thaFormula.com - So the album itself when is it dropping?

El-P - It's dropping March 20th and I produced the whole record. Aesop Rock drops a verse, Cage drops a verse and that's about it.

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